[VeryDiscoSport]

Very interesting reading all this. Just a reminder that mine has happened at 3200 miles. I'm on family holidays at moment so not seeing dealer for 10 days. But they have been notified. Has anyone else had this problem at about 3k miles?

Hi Bunty. Today you are very probably experiencing the early service call for much the same reason as everyone else - you don't need to be Sherlock Holmes to see that that not one of these Ingenium diesel cars will ever make it to the sales brochure's headline service interval of 21000 miles. The reasons for this are pretty much covered by posts in this thread and don't need repeating.

However, your case is exceptional and, having read your posts back to January, I would say that the initial problem with the full filter was very specific to your car and has gone on to exacerbate a more general problem that everyone else seems to be experiencing with diesel dilution. Hindsight is a marvellous thing and so there's no value in saying what you could have done differently. However, I don't think it's too late to start a dialogue directly with JLR CSC because the product you paid good money for is quite clearly not working properly and, based on your own evidence, hasn't been right from the start. Make a complaint now and include everything that occurred from day one because there's a very good chance that it is all connected. You might well have to go back to the dealer to get things fixed but then you might find that their attitude is markedly different when thay are acting as JLR's agent in a warranty investigation case. Remember that the dealer doesn't share JLR's larger concerns about the quality of the product and the potential long-term damage to it's reputation and consequent impact on revenue which will result if this problem mushrooms out of control. The iron is hot - I would strike it now...

 

[VeryDiscoSport]

Looking on an oil analysis site last night, they said they provide simply a pass or fail result on fuel contamination, and the threshold is 2%. So on that basis you're already a 'fail'.

I fully appreciate that, hence the laboratory analysis to get at the facts. For what it's worth, though, I also know that I cannot possibly be the only one - not by a long chalk. I mean, come on, why are we all having to get a service so early in the first place? If you follow a simple train of logic then I'm actually acting earlier than most because mine is only 4.2% whereas if you wait for the service light to come on, your diesel dilution level is a whopping 250% higher than what these oil experts are recommending.

So the service light suddenly coming on at, say, 11500 miles could well mean that you have just scored 7% in the diesel dilution derby ! The problem for drivers is that they can see the "miles to next service" but NOT the actual diesel dlutiion that is contributing to the number of miles. Only a dealer can see that on the service reset page as per the print-out I posted above.

 

[DONE]

Let us know if the oil service is covered under the service plan. Consensus so far is that it's not, although mine was done "as a warranty item".

DS went in on Friday for "Oil Service" as indicated by warning light coming on at 11000 miles a couple of weeks ago, (Now done 11400).
Also had second Adblue refill done at same time as was at dealers and took advantage of inclusion on Service Plan.
Interestingly dealer noted on pre work paperwork that I had a Service Plan after seeing my card and commented that the Adblue would be free just as a throw away line. I didn't ask if it was all going to be done free under Service Plan.
When I came to collect car, Dealer stated that Adblue had been filled (they even remembered to replace the filler cap this time) , and that the oil and filter had been changed under warranty as it had exceeded the acceptable level of fuel contamination . - (possibly due to a lot of short journeys).
Service indicator now says 19800 to next service, but I will take it in at 21000 as per schedule.
It will be interesting to see if I get it done under warranty when it asks for another oil service when I get to 32000.

 

[Guest]

It's going to be interesting what they have to say about fuel contamination when mine goes in on Thursday. Done less than 10,000 miles and not generally used for short journeys.

Just before we went on a 300mile round trip to Gatwick airport the computer stated 1200 miles to next service, on return it stated 300 miles to next service.

How can that be down to short journeys?

 

[Guest]

It's going to be interesting what they have to say about fuel contamination when mine goes in on Thursday. Done less than 10,000 miles and not generally used for short journeys.

Just before we went on a 300mile round trip to Gatwick airport the computer stated 1200 miles to next service, on return it stated 300 miles to next service.

How can that rapid decline be down to short journeys?

 

[DONE]

It's going to be interesting what they have to say about fuel contamination when mine goes in on Thursday. Done less than 10,000 miles and not generally used for short journeys.

Just before we went on a 300mile round trip to Gatwick airport the computer stated 1200 miles to next service, on return it stated 300 miles to next service.

How can that be down to short journeys?

I average about 250 - 300 miles per week of which 180 include commuting 18 miles each way to work, the rest made up of multiple short runs of 5-10 miles each. In addition to this I've clocked up 4 x 700 mile round trips to the Lake District in 9 months of ownership. So, not entirely all short journeys.

 

[VeryDiscoSport]

It's going to be interesting what they have to say about fuel contamination when mine goes in on Thursday. Done less than 10,000 miles and not generally used for short journeys.

Just before we went on a 300mile round trip to Gatwick airport the computer stated 1200 miles to next service, on return it stated 300 miles to next service.

How can that be down to short journeys?

It isn't short journeys. Sample the oil in preparation for a full laboratory analysis including trace elements present in ppm before the evidence is lost and ask to see the diesel dilution estimate on the service reset page. My lab report is back and it isn't good news. I can't say more now but good luck with it.

 

[Mamil]

It isn't short journeys. Sample the oil in preparation for a full laboratory analysis including trace elements present in ppm before the evidence is lost and ask to see the diesel dilution estimate on the service reset page. My lab report is back and it isn't good news. I can't say more now but good luck with it.

Awww, how can you leave us hanging on like that! At least tell us if the oil analysis confirmed the engine's own estimate of 4.2% dilution?

 

[simon]

If the service indicator was reset (based on LR advice that the request was false one) I assume the indicator would re-appear if the oil is being checked by sensors and contamination was still present?

 

[Dashnine]

If the service indicator was reset (based on LR advice that the request was false one) I assume the indicator would re-appear if the oil is being checked by sensors and contamination was still present?

The oil isn't checked by sensors, it's a calculation based on "driving style and the frequency of the active regeneration and duration".

 

[Zedman]

So the frequency of short or long journeys would affect the service interval fairly significantly then?

 

[Dashnine]

So the frequency of short or long journeys would affect the service interval fairly significantly then?

I think that's the assumption, i.e. short journeys means failed DPF regens (so not sure if it tries again next trip or waits until the filters full again). Mine kicked off this morning into work and won't have finished - be interesting to see if it kicks in on the way home. There's no actual definition of the 'driving style' mentioned.

 

[VeryDiscoSport]

It isn't short journeys. Sample the oil in preparation for a full laboratory analysis including trace elements present in ppm before the evidence is lost and ask to see the diesel dilution estimate on the service reset page. My lab report is back and it isn't good news. I can't say more now but good luck with it.

Awww, how can you leave us hanging on like that! At least tell us if the oil analysis confirmed the engine's own estimate of 4.2% dilution?

The actual is 19% lower than the guestimate.

 

[Mamil]

It isn't short journeys. Sample the oil in preparation for a full laboratory analysis including trace elements present in ppm before the evidence is lost and ask to see the diesel dilution estimate on the service reset page. My lab report is back and it isn't good news. I can't say more now but good luck with it.

Awww, how can you leave us hanging on like that! At least tell us if the oil analysis confirmed the engine's own estimate of 4.2% dilution?

The actual is 19% lower than the guestimate.

Thanks VDS, I'd say that's pretty good for a guestimate based on "driving style" compared to an actual measurement, and should give us some confidence the algorithm LR are using is a reasonable approximation of actual fuel contamination. Problem remains that the car only issues a service warning at 7% whereas anything over 2% is considered unacceptable by some industry sources

 

[VeryDiscoSport]

Problem remains that the car only issues a service warning at 7% whereas anything over 2% is considered unacceptable by some industry sources

And that is the real issue. My oil is no longer 0W-30 and metal parameters are high or above recommended levels. The engine is basically not being lubed properly. It has done 5K miles.....

 

[Mamil]

Problem remains that the car only issues a service warning at 7% whereas anything over 2% is considered unacceptable by some industry sources

And that is the real issue. My oil is no longer 0W-30 and metal parameters are high or above recommended levels. The engine is basically not being lubed properly. It has done 5K miles.....

That's very worrying that the oil isn't doing its job, especially as yours is not even at the point where LR feel it requires an oil change, whether measured on the normal service interval or the fuel dilution calculation.

By the way, what did the soot levels come out as, as I have a suspicion that the EGR results in high soot levels as well?

 

[simon]

So the frequency of short or long journeys would affect the service interval fairly significantly then?

I think that's the assumption, i.e. short journeys means failed DPF regens (so not sure if it tries again next trip or waits until the filters full again). Mine kicked off this morning into work and won't have finished - be interesting to see if it kicks in on the way home. There's no actual definition of the 'driving style' mentioned.

How can you tell when a re-gen is happening? My D4 used to growl like a V8 when it did a re-gen but so far I've not noticed any change in exhaust tone or engine performance. I do a lot of motorway, A road and hooing on B roads. Very few short journeys.

Bit worrying that my service indicator was reset at 11K miles (based on LR advice) as am I now driving around with potentially contaminated oil?

 

[Dashnine]

So the frequency of short or long journeys would affect the service interval fairly significantly then?

I think that's the assumption, i.e. short journeys means failed DPF regens (so not sure if it tries again next trip or waits until the filters full again). Mine kicked off this morning into work and won't have finished - be interesting to see if it kicks in on the way home. There's no actual definition of the 'driving style' mentioned.

How can you tell when a re-gen is happening? My D4 used to growl like a V8 when it did a re-gen but so far I've not noticed any change in exhaust tone or engine performance. I do a lot of motorway, A road and hooing on B roads. Very few short journeys.

Bit worrying that my service indicator was reset at 11K miles (based on LR advice) as am I now driving around with potentially contaminated oil?

Stop / Start is disabled (it won't stop - unfortunately the dash light is still on), your fuel economy drops through the floor as it injects extra fuel and when you get out the car there can be a 'hot' smell and exhaust tinkling as it cools.

I don't understand why you'd have the early service light with your 'driving profile'. It seems to kick in around 5 minutes into a trip and last about 20-30 minutes, if you're doing very few short journeys you'd think you'd be the last one to have early oil change.

 

[simon]

Thanks -9

Mine reported an oil service due in 3K miles in the Service menu (I was checking the AdBlue range pre-vacation) not as a warning light... maybe thats why LR said to just reset it ?

Maybe my re-gens happen at speed and I've not noticed then ?

Cheers

 

[Dashnine]

Maybe my re-gens happen at speed and I've not noticed then ?

Most likely, the increased fuel consumption would get hidden in the longer trips average.