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Engine replacing Balance Shaft

211K views 357 replies 86 participants last post by  CMJS2 
#1 ·
Good evening All

Very much gutted after being told by my local dealer (which is not in the uk) that JLR has examined the very high pitch sound coming from the engine upon accelerating and going thru the gears ? And after accessing some test feedback here they have concluded that a new engine is required ! Im still under shock from after hearing this. Never in my wildest dreams or nightmares would i have fathomed a 4 month old under 3500 mile engine needing replacement... Your thoughts if any please....?
 
#177 ·
Hauser

That is not turbo related - turbos whistle on spooling up. That is a whine exacerbated by rising RPM.

Get it checked out properly, ASAP.

Grüss
 
#178 ·
Hauser said:
Hi folks,

I noticed an unusual whine from my engine. I think it is my turbo charger, but I am not sure. I took a video (it was dark, so it's just to record the sound). Could the guys who did have the balance shaft whine take a look at the video and tell me if I need to worry or not?



Greets and thanks,
Hauser
Hi
Did you see this video ?
https://www.discosportforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7555&p=91367&hilit=Balance+shaft+video#p91353

Doesn't sound like turbo to me, but the sounds are very close according to JLR, so get it checked quickly by dealer.
 
#179 ·
Badgerface said:
Hauser

That is not turbo related - turbos whistle on spooling up. That is a whine exacerbated by rising RPM.

Get it checked out properly, ASAP.

Grüss
Agree sounds too deep a tone to be turbo
 
#182 ·
I have got my car back but am not sure what they have ACTUALLY done with it. I was told they replaced the balancer shaft, however am very sceptical about this. Yes the noise is less; may be due to new oil. Still there is a noise, may be from Turbo ?.

Reasoning from InControl Remote App tells, they only spent about 6 hours. Can this work be done in 6 hours.

How long it took for other members for the actual work.

Thanks
 
#183 ·
No they can not do it within 6 hours. The engine needs to go out for this.

I have a friend that does nothing else but balancer shaft replacements on J/LR vehicles by now. He has done over 40 cars and now he can do a single car in two days. So if he, with all the practice he has had, needs two days, there is no way you dealer did it in 6 hours.

Greets,
Hauser
 
#184 ·
kuruvi said:
I have got my car back but am not sure what they have ACTUALLY done with it. I was told they replaced the balancer shaft, however am very sceptical about this. Yes the noise is less; may be due to new oil. Still there is a noise, may be from Turbo ?.

Reasoning from InControl Remote App tells, they only spent about 6 hours. Can this work be done in 6 hours.

How long it took for other members for the actual work.

Thanks
Curious how the app gave 6 hours as the time taken , it just shows journeys unless you monitored the bonnet open etc?

I'd ask them for a detailed service copy of work done, including codes , it's your car your entitled to it.

No way can it be done in 6 hours.
 
#185 ·
They have had the car for 4 days. However, they didn't do much for first 2 days. I was checking the status every 1 hr :D on the Remote App.
Around 10am on Day 3, bonnet/boot open and soon got theft alert tigger, couldn't connect to the car for rest of the day.
Day 4, around 9:15am test drive. Another one about 12pm for 60 miles drive.

Assuming, they close about 5-6 pm on evening, it only had about 6 to 8 hours for the work.

Looked under the bonnet. There is no signs on nuts/bolts been removed. The car is 3 years old so you would notice if it has been refitted or not due to discoloration/scale. Most importantly, the noise stays the same. New oil noticed, even that is overfilled.

The only nuts/bolt refitting noticed was in Coolant pump area. Engine mount nut and other parts looks untouched.

I got paper work saying Balancer Shaft has been replaced. However they wouldn't give detailed work sheet to me due to data protection act.

I am going to call them tomorrow and possibily speak to the JLR as they are charging them huge amount for possibly not much work.
 
#186 ·
Bought a new DS in may this year, popped into my dealer yesterday for AdBlue and was told the balance shaft needs replacing or maybe a new engine. Whats the consensus view on what I can & can't insist ie. new engine or new car or just balance haft replacement ?
Any thoughts gratefully received.
Also, whats the legal position with Land Rover selling vehicles with a known common fault.
 
#187 ·
Mikey123 said:
Bought a new DS in may this year, popped into my dealer yesterday for AdBlue and was told the balance shaft needs replacing or maybe a new engine. Whats the consensus view on what I can & can't insist ie. new engine or new car or just balance haft replacement ?
Any thoughts gratefully received.
Also, whats the legal position with Land Rover selling vehicles with a known common fault.
Bought in May - you have to give them one chance at repair, if this repair fails you can reject the car without giving them another attempt to fix.
 
#188 ·
Mikey123 said:
Bought a new DS in may this year, popped into my dealer yesterday for AdBlue and was told the balance shaft needs replacing or maybe a new engine. Whats the consensus view on what I can & can't insist ie. new engine or new car or just balance haft replacement ?
Any thoughts gratefully received.
Also, whats the legal position with Land Rover selling vehicles with a known common fault.
Out of interest how many miles have you covered since you got the car in May, as it's a bit worrying if the shafts are starting to fail after 6,000 or less miles, assuming you bought the car new?
 
#190 ·
My Disco Sport story is a horror show - first car from new broke down twice in three weeks. I got a replacement as I refused to accept it just being "worked on" The second car had catastrophic engine failure after 15K on the motorway - really scary - pistons hit valves etc etc. They eventually put a new engine in. This lasted 10K until balance shaft noise again which I was told would cause failure again by a trusted mechanic. JLR know all about this problem - I have proof - and it affects all Ingenium engines in the LR range - I don't know about Jags. Enough is Enough - I have swallowed the depreciation loss and traded it in with another manufacturer. A sorry story for a once proud British brand.
 
#192 ·
Enufisenuf said:
My Disco Sport story is a horror show - first car from new broke down twice in three weeks. I got a replacement as I refused to accept it just being "worked on" The second car had catastrophic engine failure after 15K on the motorway - really scary - pistons hit valves etc etc. They eventually put a new engine in. This lasted 10K until balance shaft noise again which I was told would cause failure again by a trusted mechanic. JLR know all about this problem - I have proof - and it affects all Ingenium engines in the LR range - I don't know about Jags. Enough is Enough - I have swallowed the depreciation loss and traded it in with another manufacturer. A sorry story for a once proud British brand.
That's not good , I went through 3 xDS before hopping to the petrol jag.
So far just seems to be diesels with balance shafts issues, but they are a rougher running engine so more to smooth by balancing shafts.

It's now reported on diesel 2.0L Velar,FPace, DS, D5, Evoque, Xe, EPace .
Original Doc said MY16/17 , updated to include 18, I wonder if 19 will go on there to or will it be sorted??

Sure sounds less and less like the bad batch suggested earlier.
Doesn't sound like Oil dilution either as those without dilution are affected.
Lack of oil to the bearings is a possibility?

The plot thickens
 
#193 ·
#194 ·
It's a worry the Velar's only had such low mileage on them, what happens when these cars start clocking up 50,000/100,000+. Plus if they still haven't fixed the problem will replacing the balancer shafts really solve the problem or will it just reappear in another 5,000/10,000 once the bearings fail again?

My Disco Sport was a June 2018 reg, these Velar's are probably a year younger and it seems LR still have solved the problem?
 
#195 ·
DroitwichGas said:
It's a worry the Velar's only had such low mileage on them, what happens when these cars start clocking up 50,000/100,000+. Plus if they still haven't fixed the problem will replacing the balancer shafts really solve the problem or will it just reappear in another 5,000/10,000 once the bearings fail again?

My Disco Sport was a June 2018 reg, these Velar's are probably a year younger and it seems LR still have solved the problem?
Been a few with shafts replaced that needed new engines shortly afterwards , I guess out of warranty your at the mercy of good will .
You'd have to get a copy of the topix doc to see if they have a VIN range , but also be aware that VIN ranges can and do get extended.
 
#196 ·
Our DS has been diagnosed with the dreaded balancer shaft whine at 15000 miles. Replacement balance shafts has been offered as the only option. But I have read on the forum about several owners reporting repeat balance shaft problems - suggesting that the problem was not solved by swapping the shaft.

I am also concerned that the procedure of replacing the shaft - removal of engine is fairly serious surgery - will result in other side-effects.

I called JLR customer relations explaining my concerns and suggested that they extended our warranty to give us peace of mind - no chance. The guy said that if it happened again then they would take a look at it at the time - which does not give me any peace of mind!

He generously suggested that I could buy an extended warranty myself...

Is there anyone out there that has had a positive experience after a balance shaft replacement - so a reasonably long duration without the whine returning?

And has anyone managed to get an extended warranty to cover the work done on the car (or any other goodwill)?

Other than the rear brakes corroding the car has been pretty good so far - but i am feeling pretty disillusioned at the moment...

Any information or advice appreciated.
 
#197 ·
Today I heard a whine from the engine, and it sounded serious so I called LR assistance. 2017 model 8500 miles.
The mechanic arrived and listened to the engine and pronounced that it is the turbo, and he would get it booked into the dealer tomorrow.
I queried wether it was ok to drive and he said yes, but no long fast runs.
I drove back home around 25 miles and there was no loss of power which I would perhaps expect to be a symptom of faulty turbo.
Having read this thread it sounds possible it is the shafts.
If it is I guess the customer has no right to request a new engine rather than a repair?
My local dealer who has always been excellent in the past seven years usually will collect and return the car, but interestingly the service reception lady said they weren't allowed to drive a car that had a fault reported.
As a mechanical engineer myself, I think that there is a great possibility that the oil contamination is a very likely suspect.
 
#198 ·
Just a small addition to my last post, the car is actually booked in as the oil service warning came up, and when I queried this was told that the oil service warning was a known fault and it would be re-programmed, but the oil would be changed anyway. I bought the service package so there is no charge, or for DEF, but it seems to need a lot, or they don't fill it as this is also due so will be third fill in 8500 miles.
Most of my mileage is 100 miles plus on motorways and a technician told me that it should use the least with this type of driving. More pottering around urban areas.
 
#199 ·
Natsweeb said:
Just a small addition to my last post, the car is actually booked in as the oil service warning came up, and when I queried this was told that the oil service warning was a known fault and it would be re-programmed, but the oil would be changed anyway. I bought the service package so there is no charge, or for DEF, but it seems to need a lot, or they don't fill it as this is also due so will be third fill in 8500 miles.
Most of my mileage is 100 miles plus on motorways and a technician told me that it should use the least with this type of driving. More pottering around urban areas.
Very sparse reporting of turbo failures on the AJ200. The BS bearing failure has a very distinctive sound and there are at least 2 links on here to youtube video with audio to help with ID. Re the service warning, the oil service alert is usually real, so the oil would have required changing. "Reprogramming" prob means N025 and won't resolve the core problem which is too much post injection. See JLRP00100 for explanations.
 
#200 ·
BC360 said:
Our DS has been diagnosed with the dreaded balancer shaft whine at 15000 miles. Replacement balance shafts has been offered as the only option. But I have read on the forum about several owners reporting repeat balance shaft problems - suggesting that the problem was not solved by swapping the shaft.

I am also concerned that the procedure of replacing the shaft - removal of engine is fairly serious surgery - will result in other side-effects.

I called JLR customer relations explaining my concerns and suggested that they extended our warranty to give us peace of mind - no chance. The guy said that if it happened again then they would take a look at it at the time - which does not give me any peace of mind!

He generously suggested that I could buy an extended warranty myself...

Is there anyone out there that has had a positive experience after a balance shaft replacement - so a reasonably long duration without the whine returning?

And has anyone managed to get an extended warranty to cover the work done on the car (or any other goodwill)?

Other than the rear brakes corroding the car has been pretty good so far - but i am feeling pretty disillusioned at the moment...

Any information or advice appreciated.
Whether the dealer just replaces the shafts or the whole engine it will still require similar major work, I guess the real issue facing us is whether it's just the shafts bearings wearing early due to oil decontamination or whether the crankshaft etc are also suffering similar damage and owners won't know that's occuring until the cars start hitting higher mileages.

If I've still got me car when it approaches 3 years old I'll make sure I take out a Land Rover extended warranty just for piece of mind, as out of warranty the repairs will cost a small fortune if a new engine is required. This is my 4th Freelander/Disco Sport, not sure now that I'll make to the 5th!
 
G
#201 ·
DroitwichGas said:
If I've still got me car when it approaches 3 years old I'll make sure I take out a Land Rover extended warranty just for piece of mind, as out of warranty the repairs will cost a small fortune if a new engine is required.
Even with the LR extended warranty some repairs may still cost you a small fortune. Check out the small print, particularly the bit the excludes "known faults" :evil:
 
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