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JLR Position on Free oil services

7K views 52 replies 20 participants last post by  Past master 
#1 ·
Dear CRC
Some owners have reported receiving messages containing the following.

Thank you for your DM.

As a Service Plan has been taken out on your vehicle, any oil and filter changes that are required on your vehicle prior to a service will be covered free of charge as a goodwill gesture, providing your vehicle is within its 3 year manufacturer's warranty.

Outside of the manufacturers warranty this would need to be assessed on a case by case basis.
Thanks, Becci - Land Rover UK


Questions raised by the above are.
1. Will the free of charge oil and filter changes still be available for cars with alternative Service arrangements?
2. What does "assessed on a case by case basis" mean in practice and is this going to be linked with having a service plan?
3. Months ago CRC promised to update this forum on progress towards fixing the core problem. Are you any nearer to finding a long term solution?
Thank you for your assistance. With new fleet acquisitions (12-16 large estate/SUV) in the pipeline my company wants to see JLR make public its intentions on these matters. If nothing has changed regarding the 180HP diesels we would like to know so we can make the necessary changes to our fleet strategy
Best regards.
 
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#27 ·
shouldvegotamerc said:
CRC@LandRover said:
Good afternoon,

Thank you all for your comments.

Should a vehicle require a service prior to the scheduled service a booking would need to be made with an approved Land Rover retailer to enable them to investigate the concerns further.

If an oil and filter change is required due to oil dilution this should be covered under the manufacturers warranty period.

Once the vehicle is outside of the manufacturers warranty each case is reviewed to establish if Land Rover will cover the cost of this. I would like to advise that many different factors are taken into consideration during the review.

Unfortunately at present this is still being investigated by the engineering team therefore I do not have any further updates I am able to provide to you at this time.

Thanks, Stacie
Dear CRC

Do you have any further information on this matter? I am very concerned that, rather than fix the problem causing the oil dilution, JLR long since stopped looking for an engineering solution and is now trying to mask a major defect by telling its dealers to ignore customers' requests for assistance. Another owner has just reported on this forum that their dealer refuses to perform an oil change with diesel dilution of over 7%, despite the fact that they have a service plan. The other comments that this poster attributes to your dealership are very distressing for a prospective customer to read.

This has gone on for long enough. Please provide an update or this organisation will be pleased to take its business elsewhere.

This is the post I am referring to: Oil Service

Best Regards
Hi Shouldvegotamerc,

Thank you for your comment.

I can confirm that Land Rover are currently working on a software enhancement in regards to the concerns that have been raised.

Unfortunately at this time, we have not been provided with an update as to when this will be released.

Once I have received further information I will arrange for the details to be posted in this forum.

I apologise for any inconvenience that this may cause.

Thanks,
Becci
 
#28 ·
So judging by that response, that it appears to be software related, shall we all just ignore our Service Lights when they come on then? After all, it's a software error right? RIGHT?? ......

Ye Gods, they have known about this issue for nigh on TWO YEARS now......and they are trying to tell everyone that it's a software gremlin? Give me strength.....
 
#29 ·
The software update will just change the algorithm that calculates oil dilution based on the number of incomplete DPF regenerations. Or - worse - it will completely disregard the calculated oil dilution percentage altogether and will fix the service intervals at 21,000 miles or two years (whichever comes soonest).

Meanwhile, the only way to be sure what state your oil is in, is to get it professionally tested in a lab, like Millers Oils, or have it changed every 6,000 miles (to be on the safe side).

I have no affiliation will Millers Oils other than they have provided me with a good service over the last two years and I will continue to use them to test my oil for as long as I own this heap of junk.

Steve
 
#30 ·
Dear JLR,
Help please.
Does the fact that my dealership has reset my service indicator, without replacing the oil, in spite of recording an oli dilution level in excess of 7% mean my car believes it has new oil and won't provide an alert if the dilution rises above 8%. Is 8% the new acceptable level for dilution?
Does JLR reccomend customers have their oil tested independently to avoid "catastrophic" engine failure?
My DS has done just over 6000K and the oil service information is reading 12800miles.
 
#31 ·
CRC@LandRover said:
shouldvegotamerc said:
CRC@LandRover said:
Good afternoon,

Thank you all for your comments.

Should a vehicle require a service prior to the scheduled service a booking would need to be made with an approved Land Rover retailer to enable them to investigate the concerns further.

If an oil and filter change is required due to oil dilution this should be covered under the manufacturers warranty period.

Once the vehicle is outside of the manufacturers warranty each case is reviewed to establish if Land Rover will cover the cost of this. I would like to advise that many different factors are taken into consideration during the review.

Unfortunately at present this is still being investigated by the engineering team therefore I do not have any further updates I am able to provide to you at this time.

Thanks, Stacie
Dear CRC

Do you have any further information on this matter? I am very concerned that, rather than fix the problem causing the oil dilution, JLR long since stopped looking for an engineering solution and is now trying to mask a major defect by telling its dealers to ignore customers' requests for assistance. Another owner has just reported on this forum that their dealer refuses to perform an oil change with diesel dilution of over 7%, despite the fact that they have a service plan. The other comments that this poster attributes to your dealership are very distressing for a prospective customer to read.

This has gone on for long enough. Please provide an update or this organisation will be pleased to take its business elsewhere.

This is the post I am referring to: Oil Service

Best Regards
Hi Shouldvegotamerc,

Thank you for your comment.

I can confirm that Land Rover are currently working on a software enhancement in regards to the concerns that have been raised.

Unfortunately at this time, we have not been provided with an update as to when this will be released.

Once I have received further information I will arrange for the details to be posted in this forum.

I apologise for any inconvenience that this may cause.

Thanks,
Becci
Hurry up, I'm getting fed up of these too frequent oil changes. Diluted oil means more engine wear.
 
#32 ·
Lutra said:
Dear JLR,
Help please.
Does the fact that my dealership has reset my service indicator, without replacing the oil, in spite of recording an oli dilution level in excess of 7% mean my car believes it has new oil and won't provide an alert if the dilution rises above 8%. Is 8% the new acceptable level for dilution?
Does JLR reccomend customers have their oil tested independently to avoid "catastrophic" engine failure?
My DS has done just over 6000K and the oil service information is reading 12800miles.
Hi Lutra,

Thank you for your comment.

I can confirm that Land Rover are currently working on an official statement in regards to the concerns that have been raised.

Unfortunately at this time, we have not been provided with an update as to when this will be released, probably never.

Once I have received further information I will eventually arrange for the details to be posted in this forum and made public.

I apologise for any inconvenience that this may cause. In the meantime, please don't hold your breath, and do whatever you feel that you need to do - we've had your dosh, so we don't care!

Thanks,
The Cravat
 
#33 ·
Badgerface said:
Lutra said:
Dear JLR,
Help please.
Does the fact that my dealership has reset my service indicator, without replacing the oil, in spite of recording an oli dilution level in excess of 7% mean my car believes it has new oil and won't provide an alert if the dilution rises above 8%. Is 8% the new acceptable level for dilution?
Does JLR reccomend customers have their oil tested independently to avoid "catastrophic" engine failure?
My DS has done just over 6000K and the oil service information is reading 12800miles.
Hi Lutra,

Thank you for your comment.

I can confirm that Land Rover are currently working on an official statement in regards to the concerns that have been raised.

Unfortunately at this time, we have not been provided with an update as to when this will be released, probably never.

Once I have received further information I will eventually arrange for the details to be posted in this forum and made public.

I apologise for any inconvenience that this may cause. In the meantime, please don't hold your breath, and do whatever you feel that you need to do - we've had your dosh, so we don't care!

Thanks,
The Cravat
How true!

Interesting to see you have a 2.2 with no dilution problems, regardless of driving style!
I'm contacting the dealer principal tomorrow. Its the time wasted that annoys me most.
Arrrgh!!!!!
I wonder if the new defender will suffer from the same issues?

:)
 
#34 ·
Lutra said:
I wonder if the new defender will suffer from the same issues?

:)
Apparently, In order to appease the Greens, EU Masters, remoaners, environ-MENTAL-ists, and all other special cases that thrive on Twitter and not in the real world, it must run on baked beans and be "non-gender, binary fluid, carbon neutral"

Yeah, good luck with that... :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
#35 ·
Lutra said:
Badgerface said:
Lutra said:
Dear JLR,
Help please.
Does the fact that my dealership has reset my service indicator, without replacing the oil, in spite of recording an oli dilution level in excess of 7% mean my car believes it has new oil and won't provide an alert if the dilution rises above 8%. Is 8% the new acceptable level for dilution?
Does JLR reccomend customers have their oil tested independently to avoid "catastrophic" engine failure?
My DS has done just over 6000K and the oil service information is reading 12800miles.
Hi Lutra,

Thank you for your comment.

I can confirm that Land Rover are currently working on an official statement in regards to the concerns that have been raised.

Unfortunately at this time, we have not been provided with an update as to when this will be released, probably never.

Once I have received further information I will eventually arrange for the details to be posted in this forum and made public.

I apologise for any inconvenience that this may cause. In the meantime, please don't hold your breath, and do whatever you feel that you need to do - we've had your dosh, so we don't care!

Thanks,
The Cravat
How true!

Interesting to see you have a 2.2 with no dilution problems, regardless of driving style!
I'm contacting the dealer principal tomorrow. Its the time wasted that annoys me most.
Arrrgh!!!!!
I wonder if the new defender will suffer from the same issues?

:)
The new Defender is being built on the larger chassis used for RR, RRS, F-Pace and D5, as evidenced by the RRS engineering mules. The Ingenium is OK in this chassis as it's mounted longitudinally, the V6 diesel however is not, as it too is mentioned in JLRP00100.

So unless it's the first of the platform to have its exhaust / emissions architecture changed, yes it will.
 
#36 ·
CRC@LandRover said:
Good afternoon,

Thank you all for your comments.

Should a vehicle require a service prior to the scheduled service a booking would need to be made with an approved Land Rover retailer to enable them to investigate the concerns further.

If an oil and filter change is required due to oil dilution this should be covered under the manufacturers warranty period.

Once the vehicle is outside of the manufacturers warranty each case is reviewed to establish if Land Rover will cover the cost of this. I would like to advise that many different factors are taken into consideration during the review.

Unfortunately at present this is still being investigated by the engineering team therefore I do not have any further updates I am able to provide to you at this time.

Thanks, Stacie
Hi Stacie, I'm new to the forum so I've only just found this post.

You wrote this a little over 5 months ago but, judging by my experience today, this stance has now changed.

Can you update us with the current position as far as CRC are concerned?
 
#37 ·
Can you update us with the current position as far as CRC are concerned?

No bloody chance. No admission, no update, no official stance......nor will there EVER be!
 
#38 ·
I purchased my Discovery Sport TD4 180 from new some 12 Months ago. Within 5 Months, the Service Indicator came on. The car at that time had done approximately 3500 miles. An oil change was needed. I subsequently booked my car in and had the oil and filter changed in June of this year, over 8 weeks later at 4500 miles ( This was the earliest date available at my local dealer at the time) they found 10 % oil dilution and performed the required oil change

In November of this year, the service light came on again at 6500 miles indicating I needed another oil change. This oil change was again performed by the local dealer last week at 7300 miles with a 7.5% oil dilution value. Whilst I was told this oil change would be free ( As I have a Service Plan ) The dealer in question informed me that they would only perform another 3 max oil changes, under the plan. So in effect using up my service credits, by all accounts, rather than replacing the oil and filter under warranty?

Understandably I'm not particularly happy. As the dealer has indicated that they will start charging for this in the near future?

Whilst I do mostly suburban driving 90% of the time, my vehicle is used on the motorway around 10% of the time and at least once every 3 weeks I do a 40+ mile motorway journey, travelling on or near the max speed limit. I have also made additional unnecessary motorway journeys when the DPF regeneration warning has come on, which it does periodically.

However, this seems to have made very little difference, given the frequency of my oil changes. I've read a couple of technical articles which make interesting reading, Whilst I can't vouch for there authenticity, they appear to be professional engineering reports about the Landrover Discovery Sport and Evoque Diesel engines and include the specific DPF issue.

My understanding is that there is a serious design fault. The article states that the Diesel particulate filter has been placed a lot lower down the exhaust system in these models and is effectively far too far away from the engine to get hot enough to burn off and vaporise the soot during passive regeneration. Effectively resulting in oil contamination. Active regeneration only occurs when driving the car at high speed and realistically this can only be done whilst driving on a motorway regularly.

My understanding is that there is no actual fix, as far as I'm aware. Perhaps someone can otherwise confirm if this is correct or not?

Had I know about this issue, I would never have purchased the Discovery Sport. I was also given the sale literature, by Land Rover before I purchased, (Now withdrawn) that stated a 21000 mil service interval.

Interesting my local Land Rover dealer tried to get me to sign a disclaimer, when I last went in, to indicate that I'm fully aware of the DPF warning and how best I should drive my Vehicle? Frankly, I found this quite bizarre. See attached document. . Obviously, I declined to sign it and return it to them. Has anyone else been handed this document? Please see the attached. I found the whole thing somewhat insulting, In all likelihood, I'll be speaking to Land Rover customer service in the very near future.
Font Material property Recipe Paper Document

View attachment 674
 

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#39 ·
It's an arse covering exercise by the dealer so that they can shirk their responsibilities, and I am guessing that something has changed quietly behind the scenes regarding the way that they can claim the cost back on warranty from JLR.

Don't sign it. You are not under any obligation to, and your contract of sale remains with the supplying dealership if it wasn't this one.
 
#40 ·
clarnick said:
I purchased my Discovery Sport TD4 180 from new some 12 Months ago. Within 5 Months, the Service Indicator came on. The car at that time had done approximately 3500 miles. An oil change was needed. I subsequently booked my car in and had the oil and filter changed in June of this year, over 8 weeks later at 4500 miles ( This was the earliest date available at my local dealer at the time) they found 10 % oil dilution and performed the required oil change

In November of this year, the service light came on again at 6500 miles indicating I needed another oil change. This oil change was again performed by the local dealer last week at 7300 miles with a 7.5% oil dilution value. Whilst I was told this oil change would be free ( As I have a Service Plan ) The dealer in question informed me that they would only perform another 3 max oil changes, under the plan. So in effect using up my service credits, by all accounts, rather than replacing the oil and filter under warranty?

Understandably I'm not particularly happy. As the dealer has indicated that they will start charging for this in the near future?

Whilst I do mostly suburban driving 90% of the time, my vehicle is used on the motorway around 10% of the time and at least once every 3 weeks I do a 40+ mile motorway journey, travelling on or near the max speed limit. I have also made additional unnecessary motorway journeys when the DPF regeneration warning has come on, which it does periodically.

However, this seems to have made very little difference, given the frequency of my oil changes. I've read a couple of technical articles which make interesting reading, Whilst I can't vouch for there authenticity, they appear to be professional engineering reports about the Landrover Discovery Sport and Evoque Diesel engines and include the specific DPF issue.

My understanding is that there is a serious design fault. The article states that the Diesel particulate filter has been placed a lot lower down the exhaust system in these models and is effectively far too far away from the engine to get hot enough to burn off and vaporise the soot during passive regeneration. Effectively resulting in oil contamination. Active regeneration only occurs when driving the car at high speed and realistically this can only be done whilst driving on a motorway regularly.

My understanding is that there is no actual fix, as far as I'm aware. Perhaps someone can otherwise confirm if this is correct or not?

Had I know about this issue, I would never have purchased the Discovery Sport. I was also given the sale literature, by Land Rover before I purchased, (Now withdrawn) that stated a 21000 mil service interval.

Interesting my local Land Rover dealer tried to get me to sign a disclaimer, when I last went in, to indicate that I'm fully aware of the DPF warning and how best I should drive my Vehicle? Frankly, I found this quite bizarre. See attached document. . Obviously, I declined to sign it and return it to them. Has anyone else been handed this document? Please see the attached. I found the whole thing somewhat insulting, In all likelihood, I'll be speaking to Land Rover customer service in the very near future.
car1.jpg
car2.jpg
Hi clarnick

Thank you for your post.

I am deeply sorry to hear of the concerns you have with your retailer regarding the DPF. I have raised the question with our technical assistance team and will update you with a response as and when I receive it.

If you wish to receive this information via PM then please confirm. If however, you would like me to contact you via email then please may I request you provide me with the following:

Your email address
Your personal details

Many Thanks

Dan - Land Rover UK
 
#41 ·
pistonbroker said:
CRC@LandRover said:
Good afternoon,

Thank you all for your comments.

Should a vehicle require a service prior to the scheduled service a booking would need to be made with an approved Land Rover retailer to enable them to investigate the concerns further.

If an oil and filter change is required due to oil dilution this should be covered under the manufacturers warranty period.

Once the vehicle is outside of the manufacturers warranty each case is reviewed to establish if Land Rover will cover the cost of this. I would like to advise that many different factors are taken into consideration during the review.

Unfortunately at present this is still being investigated by the engineering team therefore I do not have any further updates I am able to provide to you at this time.

Thanks, Stacie
Hi Stacie, I'm new to the forum so I've only just found this post.

You wrote this a little over 5 months ago but, judging by my experience today, this stance has now changed.

Can you update us with the current position as far as CRC are concerned?
Hi pistonbroker

Thank you for your post.

Please find below the current position of JLR on this matter:

Should the Service light illuminate prior to a service being due, we advise that your vehicle would need to be booked in with your local approved retailer.

Our approved retailers will test the vehicle and should the cause of the concern be the oil dilution on your vehicle the retailer will arrange for this to be covered under the terms of the manufacturer's warranty. This is to ensure that the costs would not be passed onto our customers.

Any service plans that have been taken out will remain unaffected and you will still benefit from the services details in your plan. Should the oil require replacement prior or after a service has been completed, this will not include a full service completed and therefore will once again not affect your plan.

I hope this answers your concern, if you have any further questions please do not hesitate to contact me

Thanks

Dan - Land Rover UK
 
#42 ·
Thanks for the clarification Dan.

My car has covered 6880 miles since it was registered in March so my understanding is that it's a long way off when its service is due. Is that correct?

On that basis, my expectation was for Taunton Land Rover to complete the Oil Service free of charge yesterday, having advised me that my oil dilution is at 9.9%. But they insisted they would have to charge me £220.

They did advise that their sales team are covering the cost of these early oil services if the car was sourced from them though. That in itself is a bit odd, isn't it, if you guys are happy to cover this work under the warranty?

Keith Beards has emailed me this morning as a result of my contact via Twitter yesterday so I shall look forward to hearing from him.
 
#44 ·
pistonbroker said:
Thanks for the clarification Dan.

My car has covered 6880 miles since it was registered in March so my understanding is that it's a long way off when its service is due. Is that correct?

On that basis, my expectation was for Taunton Land Rover to complete the Oil Service free of charge yesterday, having advised me that my oil dilution is at 9.9%. But they insisted they would have to charge me £220.

They did advise that their sales team are covering the cost of these early oil services if the car was sourced from them though. That in itself is a bit odd, isn't it, if you guys are happy to cover this work under the warranty?

Keith Beards has emailed me this morning as a result of my contact via Twitter yesterday so I shall look forward to hearing from him.
Hi pistonbroker

I am sorry to hear of your concerns.

I can see that a case has already been opened to resolve your situation, so I can confirm that these details have been sent across to the relevant area of the business.

I hope that your concerns are resolved soon.

If there is any way i can assist in the future please do not hesitate to contact me

Thanks

Dan - Land Rover UK
 
#46 ·
I have recently ordered a Discovery HSE Sport Landmark Edition and enquired about a possible oil/filter change due to oil quality issues (dilution) and was informed that 2019 will see customers having to sign a disclaimer on this subject, in other words the free oil/filter change is being stopped. The car is due in March and will press this point as I was told the oil/filter change is £288 iirc so it would appear a dealer claiming this cost back against a warranty claim may be history.
 
#47 ·
If this is the "disclaimer" being referred to above, it is not nearly explicit enough. This forum's own poll points to an average mileage between services of around 7K indicating that the oil dilution rises steadily from 0% to 7% three times during the published, nominal, service interval. This is for "normal" driving conditions and it will increase the cost of average servicing from about £525 to £975 every 21,000 miles. It's daylight robbery. And that's before any secondary problems that might be triggered, i.e. balance shaft bearing failure, DPF replacement, EGR valves and cooler failures, etc., etc.

The smell in the air stems from the fact that most people only find out about this 8 months AFTER purchasing their vehicle. But the sales people know precisely what they are letting people in for AT THE TIME OF SALE.

It is so sad to be witnessing the remains of the once-proud UK motor industry behaving like highwaymen.

View attachment 674
 

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#48 ·
So reading that, we shouldn't be driving our cars "in cold weather". Now I realise what's wrong with my driving style.
That said, I haven't had any regen problems, and only needed one interim oil change between services, so maybe the weather here in the Fens just isn't cold enough...
 
#49 ·
Past master said:
So reading that, we shouldn't be driving our cars "in cold weather". Now I realise what's wrong with my driving style.....
Car Vehicle Tire Photograph Vehicle registration plate
 

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#50 ·
^^^ :lol: :lol: :lol:

Herr Speth.... Bitte....was ist die Lösung?? Jemand???????
 
#51 ·
Herr Speth ist momentan Geschäftsreise in China unterwegs (probably looking for new money) aber unsere Spezialisten werden sich um die Angelegenheit sofort kümmern. Vielen Dank für Ihre Verständnis.
 
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