Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Engine, Exhaust, Drivetrain, ECU Faults and Fixes
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PaulCP
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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by PaulCP » Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:10 pm

DroitwichGas wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 1:30 pm

If I've still got me car when it approaches 3 years old I'll make sure I take out a Land Rover extended warranty just for piece of mind, as out of warranty the repairs will cost a small fortune if a new engine is required.
Even with the LR extended warranty some repairs may still cost you a small fortune. Check out the small print, particularly the bit the excludes “known faults” :evil:
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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by Brianthemodeller » Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:43 pm

Just had the diagnosis of balance shaft bearing failure on my 4 month old DS with 7500 miles (actually think it went around 2 months and 4000 miles but took a while to get it to the dealer).

Just waiting to hear when if will be going in and whether it is repair or replacement engine.

Watch this space...
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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by Natsweeb » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:07 pm

Further to my earlier post the car is in the workshop today and it is balance shaft problem. Parts are ordered and meanwhile they have replaced rear disc which they say are corroded. Shafts will be there tomorrow and car should be back with me Saturday. That seems incredible judging the amount of work needed-watch this space!
Senior Technician said that there is no chance that oil contamination has anything to do with the problem. The oil is sampled evert few seconds and the contamination is negligible when the the warning appears to allow plenty of time to change it, and mine still had over 1500 miles to run.The rollers run directly on the shafts and there have been problems with the case-hardening of them This is very feasible as I have seen this on the inner races of expensive bearings in the industry I work in.
He said the effect is to make the shaft 'pound coin-like', us more senior engineers say 'threepenny bit shaped'!
I would have hoped that with todays technology the standard would have been maintained at the correct level.


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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by Past master » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:24 pm

Yes, except that the oil is not "sampled" at all. A computer works out the dilution based on number of regens. That at least is what is reported on the forum. If there really is a way for the car to sample the oil we should all be very pleased to read about it!
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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by DroitwichGas » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:42 pm

PaulCP wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:10 pm
DroitwichGas wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 1:30 pm

If I've still got me car when it approaches 3 years old I'll make sure I take out a Land Rover extended warranty just for piece of mind, as out of warranty the repairs will cost a small fortune if a new engine is required.
Even with the LR extended warranty some repairs may still cost you a small fortune. Check out the small print, particularly the bit the excludes “known faults” :evil:
That's why I'll take out an LR extended warranty as I sense they'll have problems denying a claim for "known faults" on a car they sell and have serviced from day 1!!


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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by DroitwichGas » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:52 pm

Natsweeb wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:07 pm
Further to my earlier post the car is in the workshop today and it is balance shaft problem. Parts are ordered and meanwhile they have replaced rear disc which they say are corroded. Shafts will be there tomorrow and car should be back with me Saturday. That seems incredible judging the amount of work needed-watch this space!
Senior Technician said that there is no chance that oil contamination has anything to do with the problem. The oil is sampled evert few seconds and the contamination is negligible when the the warning appears to allow plenty of time to change it, and mine still had over 1500 miles to run.The rollers run directly on the shafts and there have been problems with the case-hardening of them This is very feasible as I have seen this on the inner races of expensive bearings in the industry I work in.
He said the effect is to make the shaft 'pound coin-like', us more senior engineers say 'threepenny bit shaped'!
I would have hoped that with todays technology the standard would have been maintained at the correct level.
If it is just an issue with the balance shafts then why can't LR just fix the issue by upgrading the shafts/bearings, I sense you've fell for what my dealer told me when I had my shafts replaced, that it was just a bad batch of shafts, However the Velar etc built just a few months ago are still developing the same problems. I wouldn't be surprised if the Mk2 Evoque owners don't start reporting similar problems in a few months time, it's surprising LR are still producing cars with an obvious known fault, as it must be costing them a small fortune to keep on replacing the shafts in so many different models.

Edit: Perhaps they stopped producing the Velar for this reason as it seems an odd move if true, as I was told by my dealer it's presently their best seller??

https://www.velarforums.co.uk/viewtopic ... aa4709e142


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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by Brianthemodeller » Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:44 am

Natsweeb wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:07 pm
Further to my earlier post the car is in the workshop today and it is balance shaft problem. Parts are ordered and meanwhile they have replaced rear disc which they say are corroded. Shafts will be there tomorrow and car should be back with me Saturday. That seems incredible judging the amount of work needed-watch this space...
Less than two days to strip and rebuild an engine? My dealer said at least a week possibly up to a week and a half!

They have ordered the parts for mine but the delay in booking it in is due to finding a slot and a suitable courtesy car for the duration.
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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by Badgerface » Fri Jan 11, 2019 7:48 am

Have to say that I was surprised to see that as well - I wonder what TOPIx is now quoting as valid repair time for this?
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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by PaulCP » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:33 am

What is more worrying is that this is still happening on new cars 3 years on.

No doubt, when analysing their quality problems and continuing to build cars with the same faults year on year, executives at JLR can sleep happy in the knowledge that there are only 2 real problems which are both out of their control ———-

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Re: Engine replacing Balance Shaft

Post by PhilMabbots17 » Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:53 pm

DroitwichGas wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:52 pm
If it is just an issue with the balance shafts then why can't LR just fix the issue by upgrading the shafts/bearings, I sense you've fell for what my dealer told me when I had my shafts replaced, that it was just a bad batch of shafts, However the Velar etc built just a few months ago are still developing the same problems. I wouldn't be surprised if the Mk2 Evoque owners don't start reporting similar problems in a few months time, it's surprising LR are still producing cars with an obvious known fault, as it must be costing them a small fortune to keep on replacing the shafts in so many different models.

Edit: Perhaps they stopped producing the Velar for this reason as it seems an odd move if true, as I was told by my dealer it's presently their best seller??

https://www.velarforums.co.uk/viewtopic ... aa4709e142
Dare one suggest another design cock up? If you look at the Aussie strip down video there's clear evidence of overheating, blueing and scoring. All signs, if I am not mistaken, of insufficient lubrication for the amount of heat/work being produced at a particular instant. I note that the bearings are "misted" with oil, rathr than being pressure fed. On the diesel, at least, the oil can get dirty from soot, thinned by fuel contamination. Any temporary interruption or longer-term reduction in the supply of misted lubricant to these high-speed, high-load, roller assemblies would be enough to create the damage seen in the video. It's only a theory, but the number of failures is now quite large and the fault is still being reported with regularity after such a sustained period that "bad batch" type explanations are starting to sound as silly as "software interval not updated", "bad batch of oil", etc, etc...
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