Brochure Library

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VeryDiscoSport
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Brochure Library

Post by VeryDiscoSport » Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:51 pm

Jaguar Land Rover has published pdf versions of the original brochures from 2016 onwards.

This move will be well received by people acquiring premium-priced used vehicles and JLR deserves recognition for this gesture. However, I suspect there could be another motive connected with the known exhaust fault that is responsible for higher than expected oil dilution leading to shortened service intervals and possible dpf clogging. Many people picking up their 3 year old DS from an independent retailer will be unaware of the serious consequences of using the wrong "driving style" (especially with 16MY and 17MY diesels) and I have noticed both here and on the Evoque forum that disputes are already occurring following sales that didn't involve a JLR retailer. It is possible that JLR has published its old brochures in an attempt to help second-hand dealers and their customers resolve disputes that will inevitably arise over servicing costs and resolution of dpf clogging. New buyers deserve to be made aware that JLR admitted changing the marketing materials in 2017 to quell customer disatisfaction stemming from the engineering design flaw on the D8 chassis SUVs. See JLRP00100 for details.

Unfortunately there is an error in the brochure that JLR has put up on the web site for the 17MY Discovery Sport. In short it is the wrong book and we know this because it describes a petrol engine version that wasn't available for another year (like the others, this brochure quotes metric performance, leading to the suggestion that these might be European brochures, not the UK versions). The one I picked up from Harwoods and subsequently downloaded as a pdf should be Publication Number: LRML 5157/16 which was created in November 2016. The one on the JLR website appears to be an early marketing draft, Publication No. LRML XXXX/16, created in April 2016. This was possibly an administrative error but with JLR it pays to be on your guard. Note that if you click on 2016 you'll get the wrong 17MY brochure, if you click on 2017 you get the 18MY brochure, etc.

Cooy of the actual hard-copy brochure distributed to UK showrooms. LRML 5157/16

Content Analysis.

Hardcopy Brochure
Part No: LRML 5157/16
Created: 04/11/2016 10:21:54
Application: Adobe InDesign CC 2015 (Macintosh)
PDF Version: 1.7 Adobe Extension Level 3 (Acrobat 9.x)
Pages: 104

Website Brochure
Part No: LRML XXXX/16 [indicating early draft?]
Created: 15/04/2016 14:04:14 (older)
Application: Adobe InDesign CC 2015 (Macintosh)
PDF Version: 1.6 (Acrobat 7.x)
Pages: 110

Hardcopy Brochure Page 46

Available in two power outputs, 150hp and 180hp, 4 Wheel Drive and a choice of 6-speed Manual or 9-speed Automatic Transmissions. With advanced technology and all-aluminium construction, these engines deliver impressive fuel consumption and CO2 emissions.

Not only are the new Ingenium engines substantially lighter, more fuel-efficient and more refined than predecessors, they are also more affordable and convenient to own thanks to servicing intervals extended from 16,000 to 21,000 miles/two years.

Acceleration 0-100 kph, Top Speed, CO2 Emissions
2.0L TD4 Diesel 180hp (Manual) 9.4 117 139
2.0L TD4 Diesel 180hp (Automatic) 8.4 117 139

Website Brochure Page 46

Available in two power outputs, 150PS and 180PS, there is also the option of 2 or 4 Wheel Drive and a choice of 6-speed Manual or 9-speed Automatic Transmissions. With advanced technology and all-aluminium construction, these engines deliver impressive fuel consumption and CO2 emissions.

Not only are the new Ingenium engines substantially lighter, more fuel-efficient and more refined than predecessors, they are also more affordable and convenient to own thanks to servicing intervals extended from 16.000 to 21.000 miles/two years on 4 Wheel Drive (4WD) models.

Acceleration 0-100 kph, Top Speed, CO2 Emissions
2,0L TD4 Diesel 150PS (Manual) 11,7 180 134 / 139
2,0L TD4 Diesel 150PS (Automatic) 10,3 180 139 / 139
2,0L TD4 Diesel 180PS (Manual) 9,9 188 134 / 139
2,0L TD4 Diesel 180PS (Automatic) 8,9 188 139 / 139

Website Brochure Page 48 (no equivalent page in Hardcopy Brochure)

2.0 LITRE Si4 PETROL ENGINE

The Si4 petrol engine is a lightweight all-aluminium 2,0 litre engine with the latest direct-injection technology. Advanced turbocharging and independent variable valve timing helps lower fuel consumption and CO2 emissions compared with traditional larger capacity engines delivering equivalent performances.

The engine delivers a rich, powerful engine sound during strong acceleration and features a unique exhaust
manifold for quicker warm-up and lower emissions, a low friction design and a state-of-the-art electronic
management system.

This includes smart regenerative charging, which prioritises the charging of the battery when the vehicle is
decelerating to capture wasted kinetic energy and reduce fuel consumption. This is further enhanced by advanced Stop/Start technology and a cutting-edge electronic management system which provides precision control over the combustion process.
2019 RAV4 Mk 5 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 RAV4 Mk 4 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 DS L-550 2.0 SE Tech 150 6 SPD (Rejected per CRA 2015) :(
2008 RAV4 Mk 3 2.2D XTR 4WD :)

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HmmmUK
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by HmmmUK » Sun Sep 13, 2020 5:44 pm

I take it you are 'Revoke' on the EOC forum?
That would explain why you haven't updated your profile with your Evoque spec!
Long time Land Rover owner thinking about a new one! ...Bought a MY15 Evoque 2.2L in Nov 17.
80", 90", Range Rover Classic, Freelander, Discovery

VeryDiscoSport
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by VeryDiscoSport » Sun Sep 13, 2020 6:02 pm

Not so far as I know.
2019 RAV4 Mk 5 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 RAV4 Mk 4 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 DS L-550 2.0 SE Tech 150 6 SPD (Rejected per CRA 2015) :(
2008 RAV4 Mk 3 2.2D XTR 4WD :)

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HmmmUK
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by HmmmUK » Sun Sep 13, 2020 6:34 pm

:lol:
Long time Land Rover owner thinking about a new one! ...Bought a MY15 Evoque 2.2L in Nov 17.
80", 90", Range Rover Classic, Freelander, Discovery

VeryDiscoSport
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by VeryDiscoSport » Mon Sep 14, 2020 2:06 am

Sorry about this but it seems that JLR has uploaded the European DS brochures at https://www.landrover.co.uk/approved-us ... sport.html instead of the ones for our local market. Hence there is no SE Tech model (at least for 17MY, I haven't checked the others) and other differences too numerous to go into. Hopefully CRC will read this and do what's necessary.
The 17MY brochure linked above is fully authentic and identical in every respect to my hard copy.
Hmmm... maybe you should let the Evoque club know that theirs might also be useless.
2019 RAV4 Mk 5 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 RAV4 Mk 4 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 DS L-550 2.0 SE Tech 150 6 SPD (Rejected per CRA 2015) :(
2008 RAV4 Mk 3 2.2D XTR 4WD :)

41jules1967
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by 41jules1967 » Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:07 am

VeryDiscoSport wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 1:51 pm
I suspect there could be another motive connected with the known exhaust fault that is responsible for higher than expected oil dilution leading to shortened service intervals and possible dpf clogging. Many people picking up their 3 year old DS from an independent retailer will be unaware of the serious consequences of using the wrong "driving style" (especially with 16MY and 17MY diesels) and I have noticed both here and on the Evoque forum that disputes are already occurring following sales that didn't involve a JLR retailer. It is possible that JLR has published its old brochures in an attempt to help second-hand dealers and their customers resolve disputes that will inevitably arise over servicing costs and resolution of dpf clogging. New buyers deserve to be made aware that JLR admitted changing the marketing materials in 2017 to quell customer disatisfaction stemming from the engineering design flaw on the D8 chassis SUVs. See JLRP00100 for details.
I scanned the engine sections of the 2016, 2017 and 2018 brochures and I can't see a single difference.
Yes, there is JLRP00100 (show me a brand that doesn't have design issues that they initially denied followed by factory alerts and later owners complaining), but to connect that to their publishing old brochures in some cynical way seems one hell of a stretch.

It's just there because when you buy a used car, it's nice to have that 'new' experience of sitting at home perusing the brochure and choosing what options you want. I know I did. It's as simple as that, no need for cynicism.
2019 Discovery Sport 180 HSE Lux 7 seat & spare wheel - (DIY Fitted Towbar, Mudflaps, Wireless charging pad, Side Steps )
2012 Jaguar XF-S Premium Luxury
Previous - Mercedes (Various C & E Classes), 2 x Freelander2's

VeryDiscoSport
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by VeryDiscoSport » Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:29 pm

41jules1967 wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:07 am
It's just there because when you buy a used car, it's nice to have that 'new' experience of sitting at home perusing the brochure and choosing what options you want. I know I did. It's as simple as that, no need for cynicism.

With respect, I suggest you take a closer look. These brochures were produced for the European market. Where are the proper ones for the UK? I know they exist because I've got one. Consequently:

* In the 17MY brochure the engine seletion is wrong, because there was no petrol in the showrooms for another year.
* In the 17MY brochure the performance figures for the diesels are wrong. Speeds are quoted in km/h not mph.
* In the 17MY brochure the available trims are wrong, specifically, the SE Tech model isn't included.

Anyone who has just forked out £20K for a 66-plate 17MY SE Tech would be disappointed to find there's no description of their new pride and joy for them to pore over. Maybe SE Tech customers are too low down the food chain.

It's not like Jaguar Land Rover doesn't spend hundreds of millions of pounds on pretty-pretty marketing - this company is literally built on exploiting aspirations and projecting image. So, why not apply the quality program they're always banging on about and, just for a change, get something right first time?
2019 RAV4 Mk 5 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 RAV4 Mk 4 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 DS L-550 2.0 SE Tech 150 6 SPD (Rejected per CRA 2015) :(
2008 RAV4 Mk 3 2.2D XTR 4WD :)

VeryDiscoSport
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by VeryDiscoSport » Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:28 pm

VeryDiscoSport wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:29 pm
41jules1967 wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:07 am
It's just there because when you buy a used car, it's nice to have that 'new' experience of sitting at home perusing the brochure and choosing what options you want. I know I did. It's as simple as that, no need for cynicism.

With respect, I suggest you take a closer look. These brochures were produced for the European market. Where are the proper ones for the UK? I know they exist because I've got one. Consequently:

* In the 17MY brochure the engine seletion is wrong, because there was no petrol in the showrooms for another year.
* In the 17MY brochure the performance figures for the diesels are wrong. Speeds are quoted in km/h not mph.
* In the 17MY brochure the available trims are wrong, specifically, the SE Tech model isn't included.

Anyone who has just forked out £20K for a 66-plate 17MY SE Tech would be disappointed to find there's no description of their new pride and joy for them to pore over. Maybe SE Tech customers are too low down the food chain.

It's not like Jaguar Land Rover doesn't spend hundreds of millions of pounds on pretty-pretty marketing - this company is literally built on exploiting aspirations and projecting image. So, why not apply the quality program they're always banging on about and, just for a change, get something right first time?

Other issues found in the first 20 out of 104 (110) pages:

17MY UK Hard Copy Brochure
Up to 3 x 12v power points
InControl Touch Pro is available on HSE, HSE Black, HSE Luxury, HSE Dynamic Lux


17MY Euro Brochure
Up to 4 x 12v power points
Optional 10" Touchscreen (no InControl TouchPro)
Available on SE HSE and HSE Luxury


17MY UK Hard Copy Brochure
EXTERIOR
The Discovery Sport HSE Dynamic Lux delivers a more assertive stance.....


17MY Euro Brochure
EXTERIOR
The Discovery Sport Dynamic Design Pack delivers a more assertive stance.....


17MY UK Hard Copy Brochure
INTERIOR
Carefully selected sporting touches enhance the interior of Discovery HSE Dynamic Lux. Together with Windsor leather in a choice of three striking colourways, they help create a vehicle with exemplary levels of finish. The mood is augmented by contrast micropiping on the seats and headrests. The interior is further enhanced with aluminium sport pedals.


17MY Euro Brochure
INTERIOR
Carefully selected sporting touches enhance the interior of the Dynamic Design Pack. A choice of three colourways help to create a vehicle with exemplary levels of finish, available in grained leather on SE Dynamic and Windsor leather on HSE and HSE Luxury Dynamic. The interior is further enhanced with a perforated leather sport steering wheel, contrast micropiping on the seats and headrests and unique textured finish to the door inserts and facia mid-section The mood is augmented with Dark Grey Brushed Aluminium centre stack side rails, which are also available in striking Carmine Red Brushed Aluminium. The HSE and HSE Luxury Dynamic interiors are also complemented with aluminium sport pedals


17MY UK Hard Copy Brochure
TERRAIN RESPONSE
This feature is standard on all engines and adapts to the responses of the vehicle’s engine, transmission, differentials and chassis systems to maximise driveability, comfort and traction.


17MY Euro Brochure
TERRAIN RESPONSE
This feature is standard on all TD4 and Si4 engines and adapts to the responses of the vehicle’s engine, transmission, differentials and chassis systems to maximise driveability, comfort and traction.

17MY UK Hard Copy Brochure
ALL TERRAIN PROGRESS CONTROL
All Terrain Progress Control (ATPC) is a state-of-the-art new system that enables drivers to set and maintain a steady speed in challenging conditions. The system is an optional extra on the TD4 180hp engine with automatic transmission. Operating like a cruise control system, it functions at very low speeds between 1mph and 18mph, helping the driver to maintain full concentration on steering and finding a path through obstacles.


17MY Euro Brochure
ALL TERRAIN PROGRESS CONTROL
All Terrain Progress Control (ATPC) is a state-of-the-art new system that enables drivers to set and maintain a steady speed in challenging conditions. The system is standard on SE, HSE and HSE Luxury with the Si4 engine, and is an optional extra on the TD4 180PS engine and Pure models with the Si4 engine. Operating like a cruise control system, it functions at very low speeds between 1,8kph and 30kph, helping the driver to maintain full concentration on steering and finding a path through obstacles.
2019 RAV4 Mk 5 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 RAV4 Mk 4 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 DS L-550 2.0 SE Tech 150 6 SPD (Rejected per CRA 2015) :(
2008 RAV4 Mk 3 2.2D XTR 4WD :)

VeryDiscoSport
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by VeryDiscoSport » Mon Sep 14, 2020 11:50 pm

41jules1967 wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 9:07 am
to connect that to their publishing old brochures in some cynical way seems one hell of a stretch.

In relation to the exhaust design fault and the way this was concealed from owners, it's arguably not much of a stretch at all. In relation to undetected oil dilution that was high enough to cause "engine failure" the brochures were identified as a source of customer dissatisfaction in JLRP00100 published in July 2017. Therefore, from 1st September 2017 (18MY) the reference to 21,000 mile service intervals was entirely removed.

The 17MY Ingenium diesels were misrepresented in the sales brochure as being "more affordable and convenient to own thanks to servicing intervals extended from 16,000 to 21,000 miles/two years". The full set of cars that could have been expected to provide 21K servicing intervals according to JLRP00100 was:

16MY 01/09/2015 to 29/02/2016 65 Plate - no JLR brochures available for Ingenium
16MY 01/03/2016 to 31/08/2016 16 Plate - no JLR brochures available for Ingenium
17MY 01/09/2016 to 28/02/2017 66 Plate "servicing intervals extended from 16,000 to 21,000 miles/two years" (UK brochure dated 04/11/2017)
17MY 01/03/2017 to 31/08/2017 17 Plate "servicing intervals extended from 16,000 to 21,000 miles/two years" (UK brochure dated 04/11/2017)

The first brochure that had the 21,000 mile servicing reference removed was 18MY, covering cars sold from:

18MY 01/09/2017 to 28/02/2018 67 Plate. No mention of extended servicing intervals in the brochure for this and subsequent years.

Say someone has just bought my old car, built November 2016, first registered January 2017 on a 66 Plate. They find 6 months later that this car is still demanding an oil service every 6,000 miles and think, "Hey, wait a minute, I heard about this. I should be entitled to free oil services, I'll go and check the brochure. So he goes to the page where the brochures are and clicks on DISCOVERY SPORT 2017 (since it's a 17MY car + the date of first registration was 01/2017). However, what he will download is not the 17MY brochure (with the reference to the more affordable and convenient servicing), but an irrelevant copy of the Euro 18MY brochure which never contained the extended servicing claim. Who is going to pay for the early oil service? And the one after that.....? This new owner doesn't stand a chance, does he?

If he wants to obtain the correct brochure with the text that was there when his 66 plate car was sold, implausibly he would have to click on the DISCOVERY SPORT 2016 brochure. It's not logical, everything about this car says it's a 2017 model. The only time you wouldn't go for the same year as the car is between 1st September and 31st December - but in this case you go to the NEXT year, not the previous one. In any case it doesn't matter what this owner does because, as things stand, he can only download a useless European version of the wrong brochure. (He actually needs the brochure I have linked above).

It's worse for buyers of faulty second-hand 16MY Ingenium diesels. Following the logic above the new owner of a 16MY Ingenium would need to click on DISCOVERY SPORT 2015 to get the actual brochure that went with that car. But do you see a prompt for that year? No, and you won't. Because the brochure for 16MY doesn't mention the Ingenium engine at all, only the 2.2L PSA/Ford engine. I've got a copy, which I am keeping for a rainy day.
Date Created - 14/09/2015 12:58:40
© Jaguar Land Rover Limited 2015. Publication Number: LRML 4875/15
As we are discussing this a Class Action is under way in New Jersey where Daoud Shaaya & Others are suing jaguar Land Rover NA alleging that it sold diesel vehicles with faulty DPFs and "knew of and concealed the DPF Defect that is contained in every Class Vehicle". I suspect that this saga has a long way to go yet.

DPF Class Action.
Case Progress.
2019 RAV4 Mk 5 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 RAV4 Mk 4 2.5 Petrol-HEV Excel :D
2017 DS L-550 2.0 SE Tech 150 6 SPD (Rejected per CRA 2015) :(
2008 RAV4 Mk 3 2.2D XTR 4WD :)

41jules1967
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Re: Brochure Library

Post by 41jules1967 » Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:40 am

To be fair, ambulance chasing lawyers fire up a class action whether there's any real case or not. Just look at the outrageous claims going on right now against Mercedes. They're simply hoping it doesn't go to court and they get an out of court pay off to go away. It's BS and I'd revoke their licence for bringing the profession into disrepute. Worst thing they ever did, deregulating lawyers.

If I were the judge I'd award every claimant 1 penny in compensation, which is still considerably more than their genuine loss. Same for 90% of the VW claimants. The only ones with any form of genuine claim are those who followed instructions and took the remap, which did make their cars worse. Everyone else has the same car they were perfectly happy with right up until these money grabbing lawyers contacted them and told them of the riches they might (won't) get. In the case of Merc, nobody has suffered any loss whatsoever, and don't throw that total garbage argument that "they bought based on the emissions numbers" or "the car is worse less as a trade in". Nobody in the history of the universe ever bought a Mercedes or VW for their emissions, if they genuinely cared a jot, they'd have bought a Prius and it's had 0.000% effect on resale values. Governments and the EU have fined them already. Case closed. The rest is simply money grabbing opportunism.

For JLR, early adopters of DSs could claim they have suffered a loss due to reduced service intervals I guess, but for the majority, who did normal to high mileage, their cars met the recommended intervals and they suffered no loss, so any class action only has a small smattering of genuine claimants. Your car may have qualified under your ownership, needing 6k intervals, but if the next owner has a 30 mile commute each way, then they may have no clue as to what you're on about.

Ok, original brochures may have made claims that whilst believed true at the time of publishing, were subsequently found to be inaccurate. Not an unusual situation. Cars are built by humans and even the best intentioned make mistakes.
So, evil conspiracy to put owners off the scent, or did some marketing twonk simply get hold of a few PDF brochures and think, it'd be nice to make these available to owners, and hand them over to the web team?
Also it's possible that JLR management have put the 'offending' brochures out of harms way, if they make claims they now know to be inaccurate. Not a cover up or conspiracy, merely, "we don't use those as there's a mistake in them". In any case, under the right circumstances, 2 year 21k service intervals were achievable, even on yours so technically true, even if not for you or I.

The truth is never so interesting I'm afraid. Sure they may not be 100% UK brochures. There are aspects that don't match my car exactly too, (all the dashboard pics have a CD changer in them) but it's close enough for a general idea and remember when you say "European Brochures" they are in English so clearly not intended for foreign audiences, more likely they're the 'base' stock brochures that don't detail any country's specific line up, but rather serves as a starting point for customisation.

Not everything is a conspiracy.
2019 Discovery Sport 180 HSE Lux 7 seat & spare wheel - (DIY Fitted Towbar, Mudflaps, Wireless charging pad, Side Steps )
2012 Jaguar XF-S Premium Luxury
Previous - Mercedes (Various C & E Classes), 2 x Freelander2's

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