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Discovery Sport 2.0 HSE Timing Chain failure leading to catastrophic engine failure

46K views 100 replies 42 participants last post by  Saemelie 
#1 ·
Dear Disco sport forum, I would really like some advice.

My 3-year-old, Disco Sport HSE has just come out of warranty (14.12.18).

It has had countless issues with DPF filter, high oil level, leading to replacement DPF, numerous recoveries, not to mention the annoying inconvenience and dissatisfaction after paying in excess of £49k for a high-end model with extras on a 4 year HP agreement

We took out AA Breakdown Recovery Cover after the warranty date (yes, I know, would have been safer with hindsight, especially in light of the number of issues we had to extend the JLR warranty). on 16.01.19 the car broke down, engine 'popped' and black smoke ensued. This led to the vehicle being recovered. I insisted it went back to the JLR dealer so they could diagnose and at least they had it in their possession for what may follow, a legal battle. The diagnosis - turbo failure leading to catastrophic engine failure.

So far, the dealership has been very friendly and helpful. They have sent a 'goodwill' request to the manufacturer to replace the engine, on which we are waiting for a verdict. We do know it is £15k approx to replace the engine!!

What if the manufacturer says 'No' due to being 4 weeks out of warranty? Help?!
 
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#2 ·
Someone recently had a new engine required issue, disagreement over misfuelling / fuel filter issue over, we quoted a replacement used engine at £2.5K. So if LR / dealer refuse to budge, remove your car paying for any investigations / strip down and remove the DS to a repair shop of your choosing.

Not quite sure how they'd get the replacement to work with the management system, but if they know what they're doing....
 
#82 ·
Right everyone a fairly good news update, Jaguar landrover have offered to pay 80% of the bill to replace the entire engine! The bill would have been £12,000 eye watering! If this happen to you get straight to landrover. Once the car is over 6 years old you haven’t got a leg to stand on. I only got it paid for because of the consumer rights act and that will only cover you for the first 6 years.
buyers beware do not buy any Range Rover with the diesel ingenium engine they are a ticking time bomb.
 
#3 ·
thanks, Dashnine.

A big difference for a refurbished engine cost! Will JLR provide refurbished engines?

I have a recorded history of all the faults and recovery dates etc, so I am hoping that the manufacturer will be fair and understand the history of the vehicle and replace the engine. If not, then I will begin legal proceedings. I have a case file waiting to be passed to our legal rep dependant on the answer from JLR, hopefully early next week.
 
#4 ·
Discodowner said:
thanks, Dashnine.

A big difference for a refurbished engine cost! Will JLR provide refurbished engines?

I have a recorded history of all the faults and recovery dates etc, so I am hoping that the manufacturer will be fair and understand the history of the vehicle and replace the engine. If not, then I will begin legal proceedings. I have a case file waiting to be passed to our legal rep dependant on the answer from JLR, hopefully early next week.
I'd almost guarantee LR won't refurbish. Apologies, there's a typo in my post, whoever posted before were quoted for a refurbished engine, have a search and maybe ask for more details.
 
#5 ·
At that age of vehicle they should replace the engine .
Is it in PCP or bought cash.? This will make a difference if you end up going down the rejection route. Your " driving style" and all journies are logged on line so make sure you download those as proof of a good driving style.

Under the sale of goods act a vehicle is expected to last a reasonable amount of time.
You should not reasonably expect an engine to blow at the 3 year point. A car has to be fit for purpose.

Your consumer rights cover you up to 6 years

I'd suggest you tell them NOT to do any work on it until you have it in writing what the cost of repair is and who is going to pay what element of the cost. Advise them you May take legal action if you are not happy with any outcome or proposal.

You can then make a decision on what to do next, and of course pop back here with an updated position on what you have been offered.
With JLR and a new engine, at least the replaced engine ( will be new) and will have a warranty, make sure you find out what this warranty covers and how long it lasts.
 
#6 ·
Ok, update on my engine failure, 3 year old DS HSE Black.

Warranty expired 12.12.18.
Many DPF issues, including full DPF replacement in 2017.

16.01.19 catastrophic engine failure.

Recovered to JLR dealership.

JLR have agreed to replace engine at a cost of £15k, including replacement vehicle.

Very helpful team, however, there are inherent issues with this model, in particular the position of the DPF, not being located near the bulkhead, therefore the DPF issue will continue to be an issue despite a new engine.

Next step being considered.
 
#29 ·
Hi there

I'm hoping you'd be able to help given that it looks like you've had a great outcome to a similar issue I now have.

My Discovery Sport HSE 2.0 diesel auto (68 plate 44k miles) has just broken down. 3yr warrenty ended in October so I'm now 3 months out of warrenty (I have the car on 4yr pcp finance).
I was driving the car when a knocking noise started and then a 'pop' and no power at all from the car. No warning lights before the noise, just stuck in the middle of a cross roads.
Luckily an ex JLR mechanic living in the house right next to where I was stuck came over to help, removed the air box and set it in manual neutral override so we could push it to safety.
He said there's plenty of oil in it but theres metal fillings in the oil so suspected the bearings or big ends had gone and likely a replacement engine needed.
I've called JLR service and the girl on the help desk said what I expected, 3 months out of warrenty so wouldn't help, she did say she'd have the service manager call me but that was 2 days ago and no contact from them yet so I'm going to call/email them.

I was hoping you'd be able to tell me the steps you took and what correspondence you sent them in order for them to agree to replace your engine, if poss I'd really appreciate the help.

Kind regards
Alex
 
#8 ·
I can't see how you could reject for a turbo failure if their response has been to replace the engine. And outside the warranty period, too! Presumably any DPF problems have been dealt with to your satisfaction. If you want to reject it, get an independent inspection and don't allow JLR to touch it. They aren't proposing to replace the engine out of the goodness in their hearts.

This is wake up call for every JLR owner approaching the end of their warranty. Take out a policy, don't think about the expense. Not everyone can expect to be as lucky as this, as lots of Discovery owners found out over crankshaft failures.
 
#9 ·
Hi Phil, thanks for the post. As you will note from Barnsh earlier post, the warranty is not material these days as consumers are protected by CRA 2015 up to 6 years after purchase.

I would strongly recommend Disco sport owners NOT to take out extended warranties (and part with an extra £800 or so quid for something you don't need) unless you want peace of mind for minor repairs, however AA will do a breakdown repair cover, covering up to £500 of repairs (6 claims allowed) at a cost of £100!!

JLR know exactly what is going on and are dealing with these issues in volume at the moment. A fully replaced new engine and free courtesy car when out of warranty proves they are concerned.

I am not satisfied at all with the fact that 10 new engines won't solve this inherent design fault on the Disco sport. The DPF is fitted 1 meter back from the bulkhead and therefore cannot regenerate without being forced or through constant long drive journeys (something conveniently missing in the sales patter upon purchase).

You are right that this is a wake up call for all DS owners. My advice, log everything, all call outs, recoveries, oil issues, DPF faults, mileage at each incident,, it will save you £000's in the long run.
 
#10 ·
I had the exact same issue. My DS has 79,000 miles on clock and was 1 month outside warranty. I bought my car in UK and re-registered it in Ireland. Therefore, I wrote to the Irish "Landrover " representative who refused to offer any kind of goodwill.

In addition, Irish Landrover dealers would not take the car in as they were all "extremely busy", my first offer date was 1sy May and the incident happened March.

Of greater concern, was the immediate decline by Landrover of any assistance even through the car had not even been assessed by a local dealer.

I believe Landrover have very serious problems with the engines here. Best of luck
 
#11 ·
Did you guys had any luck?
I just joined this small... or should i say big club?
 
#12 ·
Barnsh said:
Your consumer rights cover you up to 6 years
Can someone link me the above mention paragraph on the Consumer Rights Act 2015?
 
#14 ·
Yeap and i have to prove that my engine was faulty....
d@mn Greece i think there are no pro people here for such a thing.
I might have to send the whole engine to Germany, so TUV or similar inspectors can have a look on it.
 
#16 ·
Hi All. New to the forum and desperate for some advice... Have a 2016 DS , Purchased Stratstone, Nottingham . Had 2 services 20k and 40k, both main dealer. Last Charles Hurst Belfast. Now 49k. Out of warranty 1 year. Got oil warning , critically low. Checked oil, overfull? Called AA, advised not to drive, had it relayed back to Main Dealer in Dublin. (Car now registered in Ireland.) Have advised timing belt is stretched, found metal in the oil which was 3 litres over full? I am assuming this is the dilution issue discussed on the forum as I have never put any in and my wife definitely has not! Anyway... they say it requires a new engine. Having read numerous horror stories I am unsure of the best thing to do. LR Ireland are clearly not interested so I will probably need to get it to a UK dealer. With a full LR history, should this type of catastrophic failure not be covered, and what is the best way to advance what I envisage will be a painful process.? Any views gratefully accepted.
 
#17 ·
Your contract is with Stratstonne Nottingham. Unless you financed the vehicle, in which case your contracts is with the finance company.

You will need to make contact with them, with a view to rejecting the vehicle under the Consumer Rights Act (assuming that it applies where you live), as "not fit for purpose"

It will be helpful for you to take full legal advice in regards to this matter.

Good luck.
 
#18 ·
As above, you certainly need legal advice.
As I understand it, and as SarahStreet says this failure is in clear breach of the consumer rights act as you operated the vehicle in accordance with manufacturer's instructions and it has not lasted in what would be considered a reasonable amount of time.
As it was purchased in the UK, you have to deal with UK law, hence, there isn't much the Dublin dealers can do.. except ..
I'd speak to JLR in the UK. This is not an unknown issue and they know in all likelihood, they're going to be legally liable. I'd actually be quite surprised if they don't already have a procedure on file for dealing with this particular issue. I'd be very surprised if they even attempt to play hardball. Afaik, there is even a technical bulletin out there for it.

I think i'd approach them and suggest rather than them incurring the additional costs of transporting the vehicle to the UK for inspection when the outcome is going to be the same, as the car is already at an approved dealership, maybe they'd like to deal with them directly?
I'd also maybe speak to Stratstone in Nottingham and have a similar conversation. You may find the service manager quite helpful, though as I don't know them, that's a lottery. I have heard horror stories but speaking personally, when I've had goodwill issues with car manufacturers, I've found the service manager to be very helpful and pro-active. The Mercedes one I dealt with actually knew the names of the decision makers and rang them directly on my behalf.
Ultimately this is going to be a goodwill claim against JLR. You'll probably have to pay some wear and tear costs, maybe 20% but I'd expect, based on similar issues with JLR and other manufacturers, they'll be picking up the other 80%.
 
#20 ·
Hi Guys, Thanks so much for the advice. I'm guessing rejecting the vehicle is a lengthy process & legal wrangle. I would be happy with just having it properly repaired. I did get to speak to the service manager in Belfast where it was last serviced . He was helpful, though reluctant to give figures until they had assessed it, but suggested typically 50 to 60% would be the possible contribution from JLR. I would still need to relay it up there. I guess the 80% suggested sounds more realistic. Though when you factor in the inconvenience & other costs incurred to date, it breaks my heart to give them a penny.... Stratstone is next on the list. Thanks again.
 
#22 ·
#23 ·
With no warning the timing chain failed 2 months ago resulting in catastrophic engine failure and the need for a replacement engine at a cost of £10,500. JLR have offered a goodwill gesture of 50% of the cost.

I have no option but to get the engine replaced but at that mileage I do not think the JLR offer is fair and am trying to pursue it further.
I would be very interested to know if anyone has any LR literature confirming or suggesting that the timing chain should last much longer than this (the life of the engine?) and indeed that the Ingenium engine should last loner.

Equally I would like to know if there is evidence JLR know of this problem and whether anyone else has secured a better offer.

To my mind, no one in their right mind would buy a car of this cost if there was any suggestion the chain could fail WITHOUT warning leading to a repair bill over £10k, through no fault of their own, after just 51,000 miles.

Any help or advice anyone can give me would be greatly recevied.

Thanks.
 
#27 ·
With no warning the timing chain failed 2 months ago resulting in catastrophic engine failure and the need for a replacement engine at a cost of £10,500. JLR have offered a goodwill gesture of 50% of the cost.

I have no option but to get the engine replaced but at that mileage I do not think the JLR offer is fair and am trying to pursue it further.
I would be very interested to know if anyone has any LR literature confirming or suggesting that the timing chain should last much longer than this (the life of the engine?) and indeed that the Ingenium engine should last loner.

Equally I would like to know if there is evidence JLR know of this problem and whether anyone else has secured a better offer.

To my mind, no one in their right mind would buy a car of this cost if there was any suggestion the chain could fail WITHOUT warning leading to a repair bill over £10k, through no fault of their own, after just 51,000 miles.

Any help or advice anyone can give me would be greatly recevied.

Thanks.
Hi had the same happen to my 2015 at 72000, was first told not covered under extended warranty but after letting JLR know that trading standards was the next email that would be sent they agreed to cover all costs with in 1 hour also paid for hire car for the 5 days it took them to complete the work requried.
 
#24 ·
I think you need to take some advice; do you have legal cover with your home insurance? Often there’s a free service where they will give you advice over the phone and if there’s more more than a 50% of chance of winning then they will take on your case.

You won’t find any literature to state that an engine lasts X number of miles and it will boil down to whether the length of time that the engine has lasted is ‘reasonable’ as that is what the Consumer Rights Act says should be the case.

All cars suffer failures and problems unfortunately, it’s why warranties exist.
 
#25 ·
I can offer no advice only to say that having experienced the same on my 2017 MY i feel your pain.

I only got 40% plus they found a stuffed turbo to add to my huge bill.

It has now only done 7k miles and needs an oil change due to oil dilution and they say that is normal!!

Repair and sell if I were you.
 
#26 ·
Glad to hear I’m not the only one this has happened to. Mine was at 110000km and costed me $17.5k AUD. JLR Aus didn’t give any assistance and I had to pay all out of pocket. They stated I had no service history as I did most of my services outside of JLR service centres.
 
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