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Service again?

5K views 13 replies 9 participants last post by  Dashnine 
#1 ·
Just 14 months old, 10800 miles on the clock, and its again shown up on the remote app that service is due (this will be the second oil change) noted the hours at 550 hrs to go for the service .
The next day having done only 10 miles, it showed the counter at Zero hours to go for service. How does it do this? how does it count down and predict miles to service? How can it be 500 odd miles one day then Zero the next day?
No message on the car dash that I have noticed, so if I hadn't looked at the app I could have missed this.

I don't use ECO and I try to remember to press the auto start button to disable this most days.
So if its fuel dilution does the car have a viscosity sensor? how does it know its fuel dilution otherwise? Or does it have a metal particle detector sensing oil condition?

So anyway I have booked it in online and requested they collect and deliver for Tuesday morning so no doubt I will be calling them when they forget to collect!

At the same time they can sort out the amber light that's on all the time for the screen wash, its full but the sensor thinks its empty!
And the ad blue top up of course. This will be the 3rd ad blue top up in 10800 miles
I have the service plan but to be honest never expected to have 2 services in 14 months.
I love the car was to be my retirement car but wont be keeping it more than 3 years now, do all the recent Landrover Diesel Engines have this issue?
or is it just the New Discosport?
 
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#2 ·
🎵Welcome to the House of Fun🎵......
 
#3 ·
Barnsh said:
Kot said:
Just had the oil dilution service today---change oil and filters at 5400 miles from new.
The service required message is really poor no amber light, can easily be missed when starting up.
And of course what if you dont have the app?
Running with fuel dilution will destroy your main bearings and total your engine so when this is sensed, it should light up your screen
like a xmass tree!! and alarm should stay active till the oil is changed.
Hi
You will find more information on this thread about the early oil change , many are affected.
https://www.discosportforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=5379

Please also add the this poll
https://www.discosportforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=6469
Hi

You will find more information ON THIS THREAD about the early oil change, many are affected (1,259 more posts on the subject since your last oil change).

Please also update your mileage ON THIS POLL
 
#4 ·
Kot said:
I love the car was to be my retirement car but wont be keeping it more than 3 years now, do all the recent Landrover Diesel Engines have this issue?
or is it just the New Discosport?
Am new to all this but it does seem that in certain JLR vehicles, of which one is unfortunately the DS, there is a susceptibility to oil dilution as the design of their soot cleaning is not optimal, and therefore the system relies on active regeneration, that in turn relies on injecting fuel into the exhaust, and the by product of this is increased amounts of fuel in the oil.

I think there are several ways of looking at this. Any new diesel engine that has all the filters etc required now for Euro 6 compliance will struggle to reach long service intervals. Short trips are the worst scenario for this type of vehicle. Regular oil changes are always good, and there's an argument that says lots of short journeys are actually worst case for engine oil and if that is your journey type, additional changes regardless of car will help engine longevity full stop.

Now, car manufacturers are all locked in battle with each other to prove running costs are as small as possible, but this is aimed more at fleet buyers, especially in the UK, who frankly are too powerful. You might also argue fleets aren't interested in a vehicles life beyond 5 years as they don't run cars that old. All of which means no-one's going to tell you it's beneficial to have more oil changes as that implies the extended service intervals are a short term con. You get the impression that some manufacturers (Merc in particular) would rather you didn't buy your car, and just lease, changing every three years.

Which means that someone looking to buy a car, and keep it a long time (retirement car) is not really on the manufacturers radar these days. Perhaps JLR dropped a ball so to speak by allowing their cars to indicate when you really should be changing your oil based on journey type, and that many other manufacturers may well just be hiding that from you to keep short term fleet buyers happier.

I can't see any consensus about what oil dulution figure is acceptable, oil makers have their view, usually really low, and car makers have theirs, much higher with reports of some going well into double figures to achieve the intervals they need (for the fleets...).

So, if you want a car for retirement, and do short journeys, then personally I think you should plan on additional oil changes regardless. The question is how often? Unfortunately for some JLR cars, that seems to be around 6000 miles. Others, where the soot filters are close to the engine in the engine bay, may get away with more, but I would go no further than 12,000 miles or at least once a year. Which raises the question of where to get those oil changes done. Some main dealers seem to charge huge amounts making them almost untenable. However, thanks to block exemption, an independent can perform service actions without voiding warranty, so if you have one locally, who can source the correct oil grade, and use the manufacturer supplied filters etc, you can decrease the cost. They should also be able to update your cars online service history, and the key part, reset the oil service counter so that you continue to get accurate service intervals as per spec. I can't see any manufacturer trying to claim additional oil changes with the OEM parts and correct specification oil are detrimental to vehicle health.

*IF* you plan that into your buying, then you can choose the car you like, and lets be honest here, apart from the oil servicing, there is much to like about the DS over similar cars. However I suspect we know far more about what's going in with the DS and other JLR vehicles than other makes. If BMW, who have a reputation for efficient, good quality engines have had to reduce their service intervals to 14,000 miles, then I think more regular oil changes are the price we are all going to pay to get cleaner engines. What the automotive industry now needs to do is make oil-only services reasonably priced and not just slightly cheaper than a 'full' service where a lot more things are done in theory than changing the oil which should be no more than a 30 minute task. That just currently leads to a feeling of being ripped off by the car industry, instead of selling regular oil only changes as a positive way to decrease emmissions and increase vehicle life.

Just my views on this of course based on what I've read and seen.
 
#5 ·
JLR video February 2018. It's obvious to me from the quality of this in-depth video production that driving too slowly in urban areas or shuffling nose to tail across toll bridges remain the two main causes of DPF cleaning problems. Its driving style, pure and simple and therefore has nothing at all to do with the need for additional servicing. 👍

 
#6 ·
shouldvegotamerc said:
JLR video February 2018. It's obvious to me from the quality of this in-depth video production that driving too slowly in urban areas or shuffling nose to tail across toll bridges remain the two main causes of DPF cleaning problems. Its driving style, pure and simple and therefore has nothing at all to do with the need for additional servicing. 👍
Surely it's journey type rather than driving style? There really are not many driving styles you can deploy in heavy traffic that won't get you arrested.

It also doesn't help when cars from the same manufacturer, with the same engine, are able to withstand that same journey type that some can't. That does swing the pendulum somewhat into the area of design.
 
#8 ·
Ian_S said:
It also doesn't help when cars from the same manufacturer, with the same engine, are able to withstand that same journey type that some can't. That does swing the pendulum somewhat into the area of design.
Nicely argued. Another smoking 45-calibre Magnum to save for the right moment.
 
#9 ·
I thought I remembered seeing that video before: it seems the phrase they prefer to use now is "driving conditions".

NoDiscoSport said:
DIesel Particulate FIlter (DPF)

Video transcript

In order to meet stringent emissions regulations all new diesel vehicles are fitted with an exhaust filter. These are also known as diesel particulate filters or DPFs. Vehicles fitted with these filters have more efficient emissions control. During normal driving particles in the exhaust gases are collected in the exhaust filter.

When required, cleaning of the exhaust filter is automatically carried out in a process also known as regeneration. In most situations the filter is cleaned automatically and is dependent on the engine reaching its normal operating temperature. Some driving conditions, like frequently driving short distances, frequently driving in slow-moving traffic - or even in cold weather - may not provide sufficient opportunity for the exhaust filter to self-clean. When this occurs a warning lamp displays in the instrument panel: an amber warning lamp indicates exhaust filter cleaning is required. Driving steadily above 60 km per hour (or 37 miles per hour) for up to 20 minutes should perform this operation.

Failure to follow this approach may result in reduced vehicle performance. A red warning lamp indicates the exhaust filter is full: please contact your Jaguar Land Rover retailer as soon as possible.

An increase in the fuel consumption may be noticed temporarily during exhaust filter self-cleaning. A green indicator lamp will display when the exhaust filter self-cleaning is complete.
Anyone who finds out too late that they've bought the wrong car might find this video useful. If it's important enough to have made a video about, it's important enough to mention before any cash changes hands.
 
#10 ·
Ian_S said:
shouldvegotamerc said:
JLR video February 2018. It's obvious to me from the quality of this in-depth video production that driving too slowly in urban areas or shuffling nose to tail across toll bridges remain the two main causes of DPF cleaning problems. Its driving style, pure and simple and therefore has nothing at all to do with the need for additional servicing. 👍
Surely it's journey type rather than driving style? There really are not many driving styles you can deploy in heavy traffic that won't get you arrested.

It also doesn't help when cars from the same manufacturer, with the same engine, are able to withstand that same journey type that some can't. That does swing the pendulum somewhat into the area of design.
Totally agree it's the design of the system fitted to specific vehicles mentioned in JLRP00100.
No issues of early service on the 2 litre ingenium when mounted in line as apposed to transverse , where sufficient space is available for a different SCRF system. And very few blocked or DPF warning lights on those too.

JLR have chosen to bury their poor design under driving style / driving conditions as it's a hard case to argue, due to many folks already accepting and knowing diesel is not suited to short journeys. They've just created a system that's at the rock bottom of workability, and efficiency and pushed the blame to drivers . That coupled with the SSM that announced a pile of faulty DPF boxes with FB stamped on them , the untraceable DPF boxes in a total quality system is a bit rich for anyone to swallow.
 
#12 ·
Kot said:
Thanks guys very informative
So guess my next purchase needs to be a petrol engine then. As my journey type tends to be on average less than 25 mile per day.
OR... take a serious look at a hybrid. Lexus, Toyota and Mitsubushi have been shipping economical petrol-hybrids for some time and there's always the Range Rover Sport 2.0 Litre P400e PHEV (404HP) if you've got £70K+ to spend: this car would do your daily drive without using an ounce of petrol. On long trips they will easily match the best diesel economy: e.g. the average consumption on my 2.5L Toyota is currently 48.9 mpg vs the 55.4 mpg "Combined" claim in the glossy brochure.
 
#14 ·
BFGDSMan said:
TBH If you want to stick with JLR then just wait for the petrol hybrid RRE or DS due in the next 12 months?
I'd be quite interested in the petrol hybrid DS in a year or two, but I just think it's gonna be mega expensive.

If I throw in a proportion of the £60 it costs me every 2-3 weeks then it might add up.

Man maths, can't beat it!
 
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